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If Joe Biden can't find the compassion in his heart to stop supporting the killing of children and other civilians in Gaza, maybe his diminishing chances of re-election will persuade him.

We need a ceasefire now, and he has to endorse this.

We need to stop supplying Israel the money and weapons to continue with the genocide it is committing.

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Just anecdotal and I know my one vote doesn’t matter (but I do live in Georgia so maybe?) but I will not be voting for Biden in 2024 due to his blind support of child murder.

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Yeah, Trump would be much better for Palestine.

Lol!

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To save time and he’s a better writer I’ll just quote Hamilton from the above article

“Biden is better than Trump.” No shit.

But it still doesn’t get me out of the house to vote for child murder.

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What are your thoughts on voting downballot?

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THIS...

While I think demurring on the POTUS vote is an empty gesture of moral posturing (If one is a registered voter, one doesn't get off the 'moral' hook by NOT voting), But like you say, there IS the downballot, and if one were to show up for THAT then not casting a vote for POTUS wouldn't be as bad...

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I totally understand your feelings and SHARE them...But my point is that if you are a registered voter, there IS no 'out' for you...Its rather like a trolley car problem, even a non decision effects outcome...because NOT voting is STILL voting

it fucking SUCKS...BIG time...

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« It’s ok for our guy to murder children because the other guy is an orange fascist and so our child murderer deserves our unwavering loyalty »

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Nov 7, 2023·edited Nov 7, 2023

Biden is a not stupid man. I did not vote for him because he "gets it"...whatever the it "is". He was raised with the same memo most of his generation was raised with and that memo is out of date.

But he is willing to bring on board those who do get "it" as Mr. Hamilton noted in other areas. Blinken is calling for a cease fire, meeting with the Palestinians, etc. This is happening because Biden is making space for it happen, which would be the opposite of "blind support". When I read about what the UK PM is doing and saying, for example, Biden looks almost radical.

I voted for him and will vote for him again becuase as at least he is open to listening. He doesn't just close his ears and throw up his hands. No solution is simple when feelings, beliefs and other non tangible emotions hold precedence over common sense or logic. Actions based in anger and fear are, be defination, illogical non rationale actions. Biden looks to put logic, and thought into decisions not just pure id.

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It’s extraordinary that such an advanced military cannot find the enemy among the thousands slaughtered. When will it be enough? When will Israeli dead be avenged? Is it really justice to destroy an entire people?

It’s disgusting that we continue funding this atrocity. I have definitely been soured against Biden. It’s amazing what we can afford when it comes between caring for citizens and providing bullets and bombs.

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Counterfactual: it was good, and worthy, for Obama to try to lower the amount of suffering of civilians in Iran by striking the Iran deal. In return, Netanyahu spoke in front of congress in March 2015 in a way that was a totally not subtle endorsement of Trump and his future envoy to Israel and son in law who actually funds settlements in the West Bank. So...did Netanyahu’s speech convince any voters to vote for Trump? Yes? Maybe?

Let’s say Biden openly criticizes Israel in harsher terms than he already has. Let’s say he points out that the West Bank policies helped to make the massacre of civilians by Hamas inevitable. Netanyahu is immediately invited to Congress and spreads as many lies as possible. Is this really worth it?

Instead, let’s imagine that Netenyahu is finally toppled in Israel. Biden can then make future support contingent on real peace talks, and if he withdraws it, there isn’t the threat that some venal piece of shit is going to come over here and harangue him about it.

I’m just not convinced that the loss of voters who really care about this conflict in New York, in California, in Chicago is really in any way proportional to the number of voters Biden has gained in the Midwest through his pro worker policies who don’t care at all about the conflict and won’t care about it as long as Republicans can’t continue to recruit Netanyahu to do their dirty work over here.

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author

Maybe you're right. Polls would be a better way to determine the precise loss of support than either of us guessing would be. But more to the point, Biden is taking this political risk *for something bad,* not to accomplish something worthwhile.

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I would also add that it is very early in this conflict, so many things are going to happen in the next few months. Dynamics are going to change opinions are going to change, etc. I don't even trust polls so I won't be looking to them for any kind of answer. I think the vast majority of people on the left know what the alternative to Joe Biden would be in 2024. You don't have to like Biden all to know what the alternative would reap for everyone. Not just Palestinians...

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The “upshot” of this piece unfairly oversimplifies the difficult international crises facing America. War is cruel always and the line between defensive and offensive operations blurs quickly. War is never “surgical.” It should always end and never happen. But laying all responsibility on Biden for the mess that is the Near East is profoundly childish and unhelpful.

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Biden's foreign policy decisions as VP, Senator and President have caused mass death and suffering in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon and Yemen to just name a few places in the "Near East" as you call it. He is responsible in as much as he's held an immense amount of influence over the past 50 years. He could save so many lives starting right now, if he chose to but he's not and that will likely cost him his re-election.

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Perhaps. I doubt you will consider his replacement an upgrade.

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founding

Hamilton, nowhere in this piece - which otherwise includes an excellent summary of Biden's record from a labor perspective - do I see a clear condemnation of the savage Hamas attack on Israeli civilians - including children. It's easy for those of us on the left to judge Israel's response as extreme - I would describe it as "taking the obvious bait" - but surely some measure of fairness is required.

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author

Hi Sue. As I say in the piece, Israel had the entire world's sympathy after the Hamas attack. That includes the more or less universal sympathy of all mainstream media commentary, and from most of the world's governments. I hope it goes without saying I do not support killing innocent civilians anywhere. But to the point of this piece-- my tax dollars are not buying weapons for Hamas. The president I voted for is not supporting Hamas. It is the actions of Israel that the US and Biden carry responsibility for, not the actions of Hamas. That's what this particular piece is about.

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founding

Actually in today's environment it doesn't go without saying.

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Jews unfortunately live with a long history of being treated as scapegoats and pariahs for a particular peoples' social ills. So it seems to me a Jewish person has a default distrust of criticism of Jews as opportunistic anti-Semitism (e.g. the neo-Nazis trying to latch onto the Gaza bombing protests to get their public Jew-hating on). If I've got this badly wrong, I apologize.

To me, it's a given that Hamas' October 7 slaughter of Jews was a horrific crime for which they lost any claim to mercy. Worldwide sympathy to Israel for what happened was definitely deserved. My support for the ceasefire comes from my strong disagreement with how Netanyahu and his radical right stooges have chosen to do next in response to the tragedy.

The merciless overkill of the IDF's attack on Gaza, where sharing the same nationality suffices for an Israeli military death warrant, feels like the military version of a husband who doesn't think twice about breaking his wife's arm because her vacuuming prevented him from enjoying his football game. And let us not forget that radical Jewish West Bank squatters are taking advantage of the Gaza chaos to wrongfully and forcibly evict Palestinian neighbors from their land. If I were a Palestinian, this is the sort of injustice that doesn't justify freely obeying anything the Netanyahu regime desires.

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Um.

You folks seem to forget that Netanyahu gave the Gazans (Hamas’ human shields) two weeks notice to get to safety in the south.

That gave Hamas two weeks to lay mines, boobytraps, etc and to commit unimaginable additional atrocities on the hostages-women, babies, Holocaust survivors, a nine year old girl.

Were I in charge, I wouldn’t have waited a single day to attempt the rescues and slaughter the medieval barbarian captors.

The death of Gaza civilians who refused to leave is on them.

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Jesus Christ, get another talking point. The "why won't you condemn Hamas" line is the new "why don't you criticize republicans." We are not arming Hamas. Our tax dollars do not fund Hamas. We are not providing political cover at the UN for Hamas. We are doing all of that for the Israeli regime, and so that is where Americans feel like we can and must exert pressure. I don't have any elected representatives in Hamas I can call. I am, however, an American Jew who is sickened by what is being done to Gaza in my name. Lastly, if condemning Hamas is the only thing that matters to you, then save some of your condemnation for the Israeli government that has openly admitted it funded, supported and propped up Hamas to undermine the secular movement for Palestinian statehood. Hamas is a monster, yes, but one Israel helped create. So start your condemnations with the occupying force that helped create this enemy because it suited their aims.

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Nov 5, 2023·edited Nov 5, 2023

Where is the "fairness" in Israel's treatment of the Palestinian people from the word "go"?

Every time I see someone requiring performative condemnation of Hamas, it's really nauseating. How many thousands more have to die before y'all quit this?

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Your concern that Biden will blow the election by alienating the pro-Palestinian leftwing voters overlooks the fact that Biden could blow the election by alienating the pro-Israel center in the Democratic coalition. The Republican coalition has certainly looked very, very fractured while the Dems have hung together. Until now. The election will turn on which party’s coalition holds together. I have been holding my nose and voting my entire life, so this current crisis in my faith in a candidate is nothing new. Even Ilan Omar is going to have to hold her nose and vote for Biden because, yes, Trump would be a far, far greater disaster for the U.S. and for the Palestinians - whatever is left of them.

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" I have been holding my nose and voting my entire life, so this current crisis in my faith in a candidate is nothing new"

Exactly...we are WELL accustomed and acclimated to 'settling'...

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if anything, Hamilton is again right. Biden is losing in 5 out of 7 swing states and his approval is at 39 percent. Inflation is soaring and I think its a bad look to be giving so much money to foreign wars when everyone in America is hurting. Credit card debt is at the highest level ever. How about Biden cuts Americans a $300 check or gives money again to parents? Why is this so hard? I did not vote today. First time I have not in 20 years. And I feel no regrets. This country is broken and the only hope we have are strong unions.

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"Voters with the sort of genuine religious conviction that makes them value human life"? I was of the understanding that this sort of thing shouldn't be a rationale for policy.

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I’m certainly not saying or doing anything to support the murder of citizens- but I would caution against taking in wholly unverified information.

I know reports of deaths are coming from a hamas controlled govt. I know the Biden administration has been doing the legwork of exercising diplomatic pressures and cautioning restraint in Israel’s approach.

I’ll believe the claims of genocide, when the New York Times or the Washington Post or the Economist reports on it.

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To me the Biden dilemma is basically this: there is a sizable (mostly but not exclusively) white American Christian nationalists within congress and other areas that truly and sincerely believe that Israel must be supported 100% in order to secure and keep the favor of God. These individuals have real power in the US and can not be easily swayed by any arguments that undermines that belief. Add to that the Jewish contingent that also believes this and the space to come out and say "Israel stop killing these people" ala Rep. Tlaib is a non starter.

Additionally, Biden may not beleive it himself to the same level as say Mike Johnson, but he, like many Americans of his generation have been brought up to believe Israel represents something more than just people in a country. It is returning Gods chosen people to Gods chosen land. Even in the clip, Mr. Coates notes how he held Israel an example of reparations. This "belief" is difficult to overcome and, unfortunately, takes what we are seeing today to even make the attempt to question this fundamentally held beliefs.

Finally power gives nothing without demand. So the goal is to get Biden to a point where he can say "this isn't my personal belief, this is what wider groups are demanding." We don't need to vote Biden out, we need to give him a better cover.

In closing, Biden is a not stupid man. I did note vote for him not because he "gets it". But he is willing to bring on board those who do. I voted for him and will vote for him again,becuase as at least he is open to listening. He hasn't just closed his ears. No solution is simple when feelings, beliefs and other non tangible emotions hold precedence over common sense or logic. Actions based in anger and fear are, be defination, illogical non rationale actions. Biden looks to put logic, and thought into decisions not just pure id.

And..I submit this article has a glimmer of hope..

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/nov/06/israel-hamas-war-live-updates-jordan-airdrops-medical-supplies-gaza-blinken-turkey-push-contain-conflict?filterKeyEvents=false&page=with%3Ablock-654946348f081e24ac48a4ec#block-654946348f081e24ac48a4ec

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“the world rallied in sympathy after civilians were killed in a bloody and unexpected act“

Nope

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Real shame here is you insisting that insulting tokens are “good domestic policy”

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Aloha🌺Hamilton, thank you for explaining the complex issue of Israel/Gaza/Hamas. I couldn’t really understand until you spell it out in no uncertain terms. And now it seems a logical conclusion that America MUST INSIST that Israel has to STOP attacking and killing families in Gaza!!! We reward them w/weaponry?!?!?! NO! NO DAMN HELP FROM USA to killing citizens!!! It’s a vicious cycle of murder. Israel kills people in GAZA, then Hamas kills people in ISRAEL and round and round it goes w/how many DEAD? Millions?!?! It has to STOP!!! And yes i surely don’t want insane tRump handing USA over to insane murderous Putin or any maga republican loyalist to madman crime boss.! And said 🍊MOB BOSS repeatedly calling for harm to American citizens. which we already have American citizens slaughtered in name of and in honor of a sick psychopathic narcissistic evil devil. tRump has stated that he doesn’t care about the future because “I’m not going to be around”. And it seems his maga loyalists have taken on his sentiment, Living for the now. and “burn it all down”. A cult leader calling for total destruction because he is insanely jealous of Putin’s capacity to murder all his enemies. This is the way we are headed And will certainly occur if a maga republican is elected as sick commander in chief because Biden doesn’t insist on cease fire and killing by Netanyahu’s murderous regime. Thank you for helping me/we understand what is at stake here. Mahalo so much.

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Is this person dumb or is this satire?

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Acabow, I see that you have no notes, 1 like, no reads and no name. And you are calling somebody dumb. Are you here purposely to troll and harass folks? Who is the dumb one here?? And yet calling yourself an attorney. I thought that attorneys deal w/factual information. And you provide NONE. Just insulting folks. Haha. 😂we pay you no mind loser attorney. Are you one of 🍊fiend’s incompetent lawyers? That would be my guess. 😂

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Another solid piece. Thank you for giving moral clarity to this issue once again.

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This column is so right on. The connection to Vietnam and LBJ is so well taken. I am terrified.

Thank you. I am sending it around.

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"These are the things that the Biden administration is now putting at risk with its unqualified support for Israel’s brutal decimation of Gaza."

Unqualified? Bullshit.

"“While you feel that rage, don’t be consumed by it. After 9/11, we were enraged in the United States. And while we sought justice and got justice, we also made mistakes... It requires asking very hard questions. It requires clarity about the objectives and an honest assessment about whether the path you are on will achieve those objectives... The vast majority of Palestinians are not Hamas. Hamas does not represent the Palestinian people... The Palestinian people are suffering greatly...”

Spoken by President Biden in October, before you wrote this article. Do some research before parroting and furthering the very thing you claim to be worried about.

Later: “This deal was a Biden deal, not a Netanyahu deal,” said a senior official in the Israeli government, speaking about the ceasefire.

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